Grand Guns

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HSharief
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Grand Guns

Post by HSharief » Thu Aug 17, 2006 2:24 am

Hi Guys, I was at the ATA Grand American near Sparta Illinois but cd'nt take any pictures because my wife had the camera and I got to shoot. But, I found these pictures from there taken by another attendee.

These four gun Perazzi sets were listed at $430k, yes, that's right, $430k. I did hold them and fondle them. That's the closest I can get to a 100k gun.
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Perazzi American Trap guns. How do you like the HIGH ribs ? The Perazzi store had pictures of all the Olympic winners and Chilly was there too. I was so proud.
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Berettas
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Kreighoff
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Browning
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Remingtons new O/Us
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There were lots more there, my mouth went dry from all that drooling. I got to shoot the latest Kreighoff. I can say, I shot a $16k gun. I also shot a DT10 ($10k) and a Kolar ($14k). The best one I liked is the new Kreighoff, it pointed so well and I was crushing the targets. The DT10 is second on my list and then Kolar. I think the Kolar is very "simple". I wish they'd let me shoot a Perazzi. They were not really "helpful" at the Perazzi store. The Kreighoff guy was awesome, he set the gun up to my frame, talked me thru it, was genuinely interested in my feedback and offerred to let me shoot any other one I wanted. A K80 is in my (very distant) future.

Drool on....

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Post by mehulkamdar » Thu Aug 17, 2006 10:48 am

Sharief,

Thanks for the pics. FYI that particular Perazzi four gun set has been on sale for almost ten years now and considering what they are asking for it, my response to them would be "Dream on baby..." If I remember right, Jeff Cooper wrote about it first when they were asking for $ 100,000. Who knows - the idiots may price it at a million a few years from now while it collects dust.

The K 80 is actually a Remington design that they discontinued and sold Krieghoff some years ago. Remington must be kicking themselves for it these days when they are not doing very well.

How were the Kolar and Ljutic guns? Though we were in Wisconsin for two years (almost) I did not see one of either company's products. I also wonder if you got to see any Holloway and Naughtons - currently the most expensive guns for trap and skeet in the world.

Thanks for the pics and report,

Mehul

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Vikram
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Post by Vikram » Fri Aug 18, 2006 5:23 am

Sharief bhai,

Those pictures are awesome.Fantastic and very eye friendly, if not heart rendingly and invitingly distant. :D . $400+ for those Perazzis is a lot of greed,despite their quality.

The Kreighoff K80's forerunner, K32 was a Remington design that was sold to the K-Company. A Plantation grade K-82 is always on my dreams.

Those Remongton O/Us look nice for their price.They are made by Baikal one is told.

Thanks once again for the great pics.BTW, Which part of Hyderabad are you from if I might enquire? I used to live in Mehdipatnam with my parents, where they are still now, before I came to UK.

Best-Vikram
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Post by Ranjeet Singh » Fri Aug 18, 2006 4:20 pm

Thanks for the pictures....

Really awesome... Lucky you to point some best guns in the world..

And you still complain that you couldn't shoot the Perazzi..Uh.. :wink:


Cheers
Ranjeet

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Post by Sakobav » Fri Aug 18, 2006 6:17 pm

Sharief

great pictures..

Why would a gun cost $100,000 or more? In my opinion just like any process, rate of return diminishes as prices go up. For example lot of difference between a Stoeger $500 to $2000 Beretta gun but there has to be a point beyond which one is not getting much other than customization... I would purchase more types of guns in that amount of money, then again I am not a Connoisseur

regards
navdeep

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Post by Vikram » Fri Aug 18, 2006 6:52 pm

Apart from the aesthetics, affordability,utility etc, aspects of a best gun, it is a shrewd investment for many people.People invest in them like they invest in shares.And most often than not,the returns are great.That is after you keep them, shoot them etc.Just check the prices of fine old guns from Europe and US-like AH Fox,Winchester-21 etc.


Best-Vikram
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mehulkamdar

Post by mehulkamdar » Sun Aug 20, 2006 9:00 am

Vikram,

I am in agreement with Navdeep to an extent here. Yes, there is currently a situation where Holland and Holland, Purdey etc sell guns that could be resold for a big profit but the fact is that there are more and more skilled gunmakers coming up literally by the day. In bolt action rifles, some of the US gunmakers can offer quality that is the equal of any top gunmaker anywhere in Britain or Europe but at a much lower price. American custom gunsmiths are also very good at making single shot rifles - Waffenfabrik Hein make a superb dropping block rifle based on a modified Farquharson design made by Westley Richards that I doubt W-R could make today. And in the UK, new names like Trevor Proctor, Ron Wharton, AA Brown, T R White etc are producing guns that are at least as good as the big London and Birmingham names albeit at much lower prices. In Italy, you have Fabbri, Perugini-Visini, Renato Gamba, Famars, Piotti etc making very fine guns that are very reasonably priced compared to the big British names and of equivalent quality. And some of the very innovative new French gunmakers like Claude Bouchet, Christian Ducros and Alain Vaussenat are also brilliant in their work.

I am not at all convinced that the big British names are going to be able to command the kind of prices that they charge these days forever. They did make great guns in the pre war years but their post war quality has seen ups and downs which is something that people are not going to ignore forever. A recent article in the authoritative DOuble Gun Journal spoke about this specifically in a detailed analysis of Purdey's quality by Ross Seyfried, in my opinion the greatest current authority on guns and hunting. Also, some decades ago, John Olin who then owned Winchester, destruction tested a new Purdey best shotgun against a new AYA and a new Winchester Model 21. The AYA shot more than 50,000 rounds more than the Purdey before it went off the face. The Winchester shot 250,000 rounds more than the Purdey and still did not break down. Believe me, none of the fans of great British guns like being reminded about this particular test, details of which can be obtained from The American Rifleman's archives even now.

This is not to say that the big London and Birmingham names don;t make good guns - just that there are equivalent alternatives at much lower prices if you don't care about the name on your gun. Karl Webber of Hein told me that one of their clients had bought two 700 Nitro Express rifles from them on their dropping block action. The total price of both rifles, an exquisitely made matching pair with case hardening and engraving with the finest Denli wood in a leather case would be less than a tenth of the price that H&H are asking for one of their 700 NE doubles - a Grifnee engraved rifle for which they rejected an offer of $ 300,000 recently.

This is academic as far as I am concerned as I am not going to be able to afford the price of a Best gun, but, even if I had that much money, I know where I would spend it. Call it the Gujarati blood that flows through my veins if you want - I call it native common sense. :mrgreen:

Cheers,

Mehul

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Post by Vikram » Mon Aug 21, 2006 8:16 am

Absolutely Mehul.Only, there are people who have the money and only that and go for names alone than for the gun.And, like shares, it has less to do with quality than with returns. I would always prefer the gun than the name.Not that I wouldn't order a bespoke gun from each of the English and Scottish gun maker if I could.
:lol:

Best-Vikram
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Post by eljefe » Mon Aug 21, 2006 10:42 pm

Vikram,
A while ago, in the '6 of the best you would like to own' gun poll, I had a query from Grumpy as to why i opted for a H&H Badminton, a 2nd rate gun,when it was a dream list after all!
Well, because all/most of the guns I mentioned there were from personal experience and I found I could do a reasonable imitation of a shotgunner with a particular shotty, which happened to a be a H&H badminton-a damn sight better than a BSA double and a remington 1100 and an ithaca.
But , given a chance ,i would still plonk my kidney for a damascus double by an old time gun maker!
Sharief-Thanks for the drool trip, PC's been on your pics from morning! Forget what they cost-the sheer workmanship is alluring in this and age of Made in China!
Best and keep them coming guys
Axx
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