Rings in .22 rifle barrel

[andy_65_in]

Hi!

Just joined this excellent website which I found while browsing for a solution to my firearm problem.My .22 Brno mod 1 (1950 vintage) has developed some sort of a wedding ring (bulge?) about three inches from the muzzle end which I noticed while cleaning the weapon. The wedding ring is exactly about 2-3 partial rings , faint but visible inside the barrel (used a mag glass to confirm).

Have mostly fired Indian KF ammo apart from some Lapua and Eley ammo. Went to a couple of prominent USA websites who say it might b a bulge! Have shown to my own fauji armourer (am in the Army) who says it is just a ring? Am totally confused, haven't fired the weapon since then considering the safety factor in mind (because of a possible bulge though there isn't any bulge like appearance on the outside of the barrel).

What may be the solution? Removing the affected barrel length (about 3 inches - still leaves me with a 20 inch barrel which i guess is legal in India) or what else? Really saddened me to see the damage in the weapon as it has been a faithful firearm used extensively in many a places and many a adventures.

Looking for some excellent advice from all members.

Thanks

[Mark]

Hi Andy, welcome to the forums!

In regards to your rifle, the standard test is to shoot it and see how it groups!

Having a ring in a 22 barrel is not dangerous, and may not affect accuracy that much even.

However, other than making it louder cutting the barrel back a few inches will not hurt the accuracy. (I have a 22 with a 16 1/2" barrel, shoots fine but too loud with 22LR's)

I do not know what a minimum barrel length would be in India, but I suspect someone will chime in soon about what it is.

Mark

[cyrixoutside]

hi,

dont go below 20 inches, in fact unless accuracy is being affected dont do anything at all



rajat

[badshah0522]

I think cutting the barrell back will effect the accuracy as it will damage the crowning of the barell,Later the crowning can be done but not 100% as done by manufacturer.

[Mack The Knife]

Andy, welcome to IFG.

What you describe is a ring or call it a very slight bulge if you like. I believe this is caused by shooting through a bore that has some sort of grit/dirt in it.

We have a few rifles and pistols at the range that have developed these rings but neither the rifles (Brno/CZ .22lr) nor the pistols (Hammerli 208 again in .22lr) show any sign of inaccuracy. The rifles that have become inaccurate are due to improper cleaning which has damaged the crown.

If your rifle continues to group well, I suggest you forget about the ring. If it does not group you may want to cut the barrel as close to the ring as possible provided the barrel length taken from the breech face isn't 20" or lesser. Best you check the legal barrel length for a rifle for yourself.

Contrary to what Badshah says you can get as good if not a better crown using a lathe. Best to use a lathe to make the cut rather than a hacksaw, unless you make a jig for the latter. The new muzzle face must be finished perpendicular to the longitudinal axis of the bore.

Cutting the barrel is the easy part, fixing the front sight back on may be more difficult. I say may because I have no experience of doing this.

Mack The Knife

[andy_65_in]

can anyone suggest some good gunsmith whom i can show this .22 brno rifle in dehradun or nagpur or pune.thanks

[Mack The Knife]

Andy,

I don't know off any in Nagpur or Dehradoon but Z375 on here is from Poona and he should be able to guide you to a fairly decent smith. Suggest you send him a PM.

What you really need is a good machinist though. That is if you wish to cut the barrel, recrown and reinstall the front sight.

Mack The Knife

[badshah0522]

Dear Andy ,,
I again advise you that dont cut the barrell without a person with perfect knowledge & Have enough experience in this.
Did you test fired it ?????If not plz do fire few shot from different different distance and check the results & post them here...
i think u have fired thousands of (free from army ) rounds from it thats y it devloped a bulge in it .
otherwise they donn come easily .

[andy_65_in]

dear Mack The Knife and badshsah,have studied the barrel of my rifle (not a weapon) again :there are about 3 to 4 closely seperated not fully developed rings( ie covering only half to 3/4th of the barrel internal circumference) anf not one ring as i had thought .but the outer surface of the barrel is perfect with no apparent bulge etc.have thoroughly cleaned the bore to establish this fact. should i go ahead and fire some ammo to see the grouping . pl advise

[badshah0522]

Hi andy why did you started a new thread on the same topic?????Now may God save you from Mods. .
Please go ahead & fire atlest 10-15 shot on a paper target.Get back wid the results..
U said u r from Army ,,So y r u so afraid ,,it is not at all dangerous. As the bulge is at the muzzle end .& .22 is not a very high velocity cal.

[mundaire]

The 2 threads on this topic have now been merged.

Andy, PLEASE DO NOT start multiple threads on the same topic!

Cheers!
Abhijeet

[Mack The Knife]

Andy,

I must say, I have never seen so many rings being formed so close to each other - even in a pistol length barrel. However, that does not mean this cannot happen. It obviously has.

If I were you, I would check it for groups. However, since you seem to be apprehensive about shooting it, I'd rather not advice you one way or the other. That is a decision you will have to make.

If you do decide to shoot it, please do so with the ammo that grouped well in the past. Introducing a new variable at this point of time will not help.

Incidentally, it just occured to me that there is another alternative to cutting the barrel and relocating the front sight and that is to drill a larger hole from the muzzle end to just beyond the first ring from the breech end. The hole only needs to be large enough to get rid of the rings. However, the machinist will have to make sure there are no burrs at the new (internal) muzzle. You really would need to have a super-duper machinist to do this job. Grumpy, Mark, Sid... would this be feasible?

Mack The Knife

[Mark]

Mack The Knife,

If the rifle does not shoot accurately, there would be nothing to damage with your suggestion so it might be a simple and easy way of fixing the problem.

Andy, here is what happened to your gun- A bullet got lodged in the bore, most likely from a defective powder charge. The shooter either did not realize this or simply tried to "shoot" out the obstruction. After 3 or 4 bullets the shooter realized what the situation was.

Now, where to go from here? Again, my suggestion is to just shoot the gun as it is perfectly safe to shoot if the only issue is a ringed barrel, especially if it is a few inches back from the muzzle.

Another option is to order a "barrel liner" for it. Perhaps you have a friend coming from the states who could briing you one. It is a thin tube with rifling, the old riflings are bored out and the tube is simply glued or soldered into place.

Here is a US link, but there are several other places:

http://www.dixiegunworks.com/advanced_s ... er&x=0&y=0

[Mack The Knife]

Andy, here is what happened to your gun- A bullet got lodged in the bore, most likely from a defective powder charge. The shooter either did not realize this or simply tried to "shoot" out the obstruction. After 3 or 4 bullets the shooter realized what the situation was.

That's scary. All this time I thought rings were caused due to some sort of grit/dirt in the bore that got pushed into the barrel walls by the passing bullet.

Mack The Knife

[Mark]

Mack The Knife,

One ring can be caused by an obstruction.

Several rings next to each other, the ONLY thing I know that can cause that is multiple firings. Sometimes the person does not know, and fires a round and sometimes they think they can shoot the obstruction out. After 3 or 4 times they figure it out. When you get a gun like this, pour some oil in from the breech and then get a 4-5 mm steel rod that you drive from the muzzle. Use a 3-5 pound hammer. Put the muzzle upwards, put the rod in and then give it some hard whacks. You need to be forcefull. Make a mark on the rod about an inch from the muzzle to see if the group is moving. If not, you need to stop as all you are doing is driving flattening the bullets and driving it into the rifling. THis is why you can't use a smaller hammer, or a wooden dowel.

If they are stuck in the bore, then you need to braze a screw to a rod and use it to screw it in and then yank it out.