Stun guns- Is it legal in India

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Re: Stun guns- Is it legal in India

Post by ckkalyan » Thu Sep 08, 2011 1:08 pm

Sadly (in my opinion), in our country, most laws are ambiguous and fall into a grey area, subject to interpretation by officials in different states with varying, accepted tolerances....so, what's legal and what's illegal is a huge question and it is a very thin line...:(
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Re: Stun guns- Is it legal in India

Post by Rajat » Thu Sep 08, 2011 1:28 pm

ckkalyan wrote:Sadly (in my opinion), in our country, most laws are ambiguous and fall into a grey area, subject to interpretation by officials in different states with varying, accepted tolerances....so, what's legal and what's illegal is a huge question and it is a very thin line...:(
This is correct. It is indeed confusing and ambiguous at times. And the first one to give a judgement on this is the local Police and not much needs to be said about them.

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Re: Stun guns- Is it legal in India

Post by sreenivas r » Thu Sep 08, 2011 1:55 pm

I bought a usp40 BB gun in bangkok , i had to run around a lot to get it inspected , later i get a letter stating that it is not a firearm but is not for public issue , i even let the cop try the gun himself , now its confiscated by the customs dept
they didnt let me bring in a toy , i wonder what they'll say for a stun gun ?

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Re: Stun guns- Is it legal in India

Post by rahul567 » Thu Sep 08, 2011 7:00 pm

i guess the ambiguity has been purposely built in our system so that the interpreter of the law( people in the govt. dept) have discretionary power for their own monetary benefit. A funny experience i had, last month i got a little overconfident and ordered 2 air pistols , The superintendent cited the the chapter 93 that only one is alowed, but with the right convincing :wink: i managed to make him understand that nowhere does the chapter 93 mention the quantity and it uses the term airguns and air pistols which is plural tense so that obviously means more then one hehehhehe

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Re: Stun guns- Is it legal in India

Post by goodboy_mentor » Thu Sep 08, 2011 7:37 pm

I bought a usp40 BB gun in bangkok , i had to run around a lot to get it inspected , later i get a letter stating that it is not a firearm but is not for public issue , i even let the cop try the gun himself , now its confiscated by the customs dept
they didnt let me bring in a toy ,
Probably it was tested from some government lab. The job of government lab is to test the sample, it cannot sit in decision if something is for "public issue" or not. Have you officially provided the customs with a copy of the letter that says it is not a firearm? If yes, then just do an RTI with customs seeking information as to under which provisions of the law they have confiscated the toy that is not a firearm but an imitation firearm. Arms Act 1959 does not apply to imitation firearms. For example there are so many imitation firearms openly for sale during Diwali season.
i wonder what they'll say for a stun gun ?
It does not matter what they say, it matters what the law says. If the law is not clear, then there is scope of potential nuisance and harassment by government officials.
i guess the ambiguity has been purposely built in our system so that the interpreter of the law( people in the govt. dept) have discretionary power for their own monetary benefit.
Yes to create loopholes in the law for their benefit of every possible type. :) The same policy of the British rulers.

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Re: Stun guns- Is it legal in India

Post by sreenivas r » Thu Sep 08, 2011 11:06 pm

:stupid:
Probably it was tested from some government lab.
I personally drove the verification officer to the airport , the officer had no clue what he was looking at :shock: he flipped the gun a couple of times , that was all the verification he did
he asked why the gun had sticker which said semi-automatic,
and can i apply now cause its been a year since it has been confiscated ?,thanks goodboy_mentor surely will file an RTI application

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Re: Stun guns- Is it legal in India

Post by mundaire » Thu Sep 08, 2011 11:33 pm

To the best of my knowledge:

Stun guns are legal

Tasers - which shoot out two electrodes and can thus be used from a few metres away, are not permitted for civilian ownership

If someone has information to the contrary, please do share it here with everyone else.

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Re: Stun guns- Is it legal in India

Post by goodboy_mentor » Thu Sep 08, 2011 11:55 pm

that was all the verification he did
What matters is what he has written in the letter i.e. the object verified/inspected is not a firearm etc. everything else is immaterial.
can i apply now cause its been a year since it has been confiscated ?
Yes you can apply for RTI. Keep your questions in RTI seeking information simple and to the point.
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Re: Stun guns- Is it legal in India

Post by Rajat » Fri Sep 09, 2011 12:13 pm

mundaire wrote:To the best of my knowledge:

Stun guns are legal

Tasers - which shoot out two electrodes and can thus be used from a few metres away, are not permitted for civilian ownership

If someone has information to the contrary, please do share it here with everyone else.

Cheers!
Abhijeet
Please share the source of your knowledge. Some members might get inspired and order these and then will need to defend and reply to the show cause notice. If you know of any relevant notification then please post it.

I believe (not sure about any notifications etc in India) that both Stun Guns and Tasers are not illegal but their inappropriate use or damage caused may be deemed as illegal. Secondly, both are permitted and available for civilian ownership. Although both usually do not cause much damage and recovery is quick.

As you have pointed out for stun guns you just need batteries or some are even rechargeable but you have to buy separate refills / "cartridges" for Tasers each time after use.

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Re: Stun guns- Is it legal in India

Post by rahul567 » Fri Sep 09, 2011 12:39 pm

i checked out this website mentioned in the beginning of the thread http://www.mangalindia.com/Electric-Sho ... India.html
spoke to the people over the phone . They have an entire range of stun guns. And few weeks back they had got 4 tazer guns also. The company is based in my town only. Plan to give them a visit one of these days and check out the products

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Re: Stun guns- Is it legal in India

Post by goodboy_mentor » Fri Sep 09, 2011 5:16 pm

Please share the source of your knowledge.
Please refer the definition of arms and firearms in Section 2 of Arms Act 1959. I qoute the relevant portions below:
"arms" means articles of any description designed or adapted as weapons for offence or defence, and includes firearms, sharp edged and other deadly weapons, and parts of, and machinery for manufacturing, arms, but does not include articles designed solely for domestic or agricultural uses such as a lathi or an ordinary walking stick and weapons incapable of being used otherwise than as toys or of being converted into serviceable weapons;
"firearms" means arms of any description designed or adapted to discharge a projectile or projectiles of any kind by the action of any explosive or other forms of energy, and includes---

(i) artillery, hand-grenades, riot-pistols or weapons of any kind designed or adapted for the discharge of any noxious liquid, gas or other such thing,
Going by the above definition of arms, stun guns may fall in definition of arms but cannot fall in definition of firearms as they do not shoot a projectile. Arms other than firearms are not regulated(do not require any license etc.) under Arms Act 1959 unless a notification under Section 4 of Arms Act 1959 has been issued by the Central government for arms of specific description for a specific area.

Going by the above definition of firearms, tasers may fall in the definition of firearms.

Since definition of arms and firearms is so loose, even a stone or a catapult can be construed as an arm or a firearm. This is a grey area probably kept as a affect of legacy of British Raj, so that the "rulers" can construe anything or nothing in law at pleasure.
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Re: Stun guns- Is it legal in India

Post by mundaire » Fri Sep 09, 2011 5:25 pm

GBM, thank you :) Rajat as GBM quotes above, my reference point was Section 2 (c) & (e) of the Arms Act 1959.
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Re: Stun guns- Is it legal in India

Post by Rajat » Fri Sep 09, 2011 7:27 pm

Thanks GBM & Mundaire, It is this "grey" area that I was trying to find means to illuminate by means of any recent notification etc. As I said it was my belief too that both Stun guns and Tasers should not be illegal but I was not sure how it might be interpreted by the Indian Law.

See as you have rightly pointed out Stun guns are clearly exempted from the definition of firearms but falls in some category of being an "arm" but Tasers just like Air guns or BB guns or Paint ball guns discharges projectiles (still connected to the gun by wires) and principally it also powered by compressed gas might be classified as a firearm.

So as you say the definition and classification is so loose nothing is certain and can be twisted and interpreted in any way they like. So apart from what we may derive from logic and common sense where does this leave us?

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Re: Stun guns- Is it legal in India

Post by goodboy_mentor » Fri Sep 09, 2011 9:15 pm

I was not sure how it might be interpreted by the Indian Law
Lot also depends on the whims, fancies, prejudices and biases of the judges besides the influence of rampart corruption even in the judiciary. It is not uncommon to hear rumours these days that judgments have been influenced or procured.

Arms Act 1959 is a law to regulate the fundamental right to keep and bear arms that has been guaranteed under Aritcles 19 and 21 of Constitution of India. But some High Courts have given erroneous judgments to the contrary.

Arms Act 1959 has Section 41 which gives power to the Central government to exempt any description of arms or ammunition from the regulations of Arms Act 1959. We also have Section 42 in Arms Act 1959 which empowers Central government to take a census of all firearms in any area.

By reading of Sections 41 and 42 of Arms Act 1959 it becomes clear that it has been the intention of the Parliament that all categories of firearms may not be regulated(require license etc.), otherwise the question of Section 41 and 42 in Arms Act 1959 for exemptions and census does not arise.

Now if we read the judgment of Delhi High Court at http://lobis.nic.in/dhc/SRB/judgement/2 ... 912000.pdf High Court proudely claims to be fulfilling the will of Parliament that Parliament's intention was to regulate the use of "all categories" of firearms. What can be said about such patently erroneous and absurd interpretations of the law when the law is very clear?
So apart from what we may derive from logic and common sense where does this leave us?
Nothing much to worry about stun guns until a notification under Section 4 of Arms Act 1959 has been issued by the Central government regarding them applicable for your area. For tasers can't say much except that description of firearms is open to the interpretation of the judges.
"If my mother tongue is shaking the foundations of your State, it probably means that you built your State on my land" - Musa Anter, Kurdish writer, assassinated by the Turkish secret services in 1992

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Re: Stun guns- Is it legal in India

Post by gladiatorgarg » Sat Sep 10, 2011 10:34 am

hi gentlemen
i bought a can of KNOCK OUT 50 ML rs 399 from a medic store in delli...just sprayed it in a room 1 small burst 3-4 secs n believe u me i could not enter the room for next 2 hrs im impressed :lol:

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