Gun Loaded With Blanks Can Still Kill You !

The legal aspects of owning, shooting, importing arms/ ammo and other related legal aspects as well as any other legal queries. Please note: This INCLUDES all arms licensing issues/ queries!
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art_collector
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Gun Loaded With Blanks Can Still Kill You !

Post by art_collector » Mon May 11, 2015 11:47 pm

The phrase "shooting blanks" has passed into colloquialism. But, literally speaking, what does it mean to shoot blanks? And why can people who get shot with blank ammunition still die? We'll explain what blanks are, why they're used, and why they can still kill you.
I'vBlanks are harmless at any real distance, but when pressed against someone's head, they can and have killed.
Why a Gun Loaded With Blanks Can Still Kill You
To understand what blanks are, we have to look at how a "bullet" is constructed. In order to be effective, the bullet and gun have to contain something to make a spark to set the entire firing process in motion, a fuel source that will ignite quickly and create a lot of gas to shove the projectile out, and the actual flying projectile itself. In the old days, bullets would come in packages that would contain all of those things rattling around separately. Shooters would have to load all of them each before firing the gun. Now bullets have all of that in one package. A sleek outer casing (2) will contain the fuel (3) as well as the primer (4) which makes the spark. Meanwhile, the projectile (1), a heavy metal object, will sit at the top, providing a cap to keep the powder from coming out. As long as the gun isn't pressed right up against someone, it's the bullet alone that does the damage.
The bullet only does damage because it is made of a heavy, dense substance. This dense, heavy object easily keeps its momentum as it flies through the air, and can tunnel into human flesh. Replace the metal bullet with a piece of wadded up paper or cotton, as is done in blanks, and it generally does as much damage as a wadded up piece of paper ever can do. The farther the paper flies, the more it matches its own flimsy mass against the pressure of the air it's trying to push through. It gets slower and slower, and can't do any damage to flesh. Anywhere farther than a couple of feet out from a blank and you have nothing to fear — unless by some unlucky chance it happens to land directly in your eye.
Things get tragic when people attempt to put the guns right up to their bodies and fire. Because they're used for show, and because the show has to be impressive, blanks are sometimes loaded with more gunpowder than regular bullets. The edges of the casing are also bent inwards, to hold the paper more securely and let more pressure build up as the gas pushes from behind. This massive amount of gas comes shooting out of the gun very fast. Once it's out of the gun it expands in all directions and is harmless, but if a human skull is pressed directly to the barrel, the gas, and whatever is propelled in front of it, hits fast enough to shatter bone.
Sadly, this has happened quite a few times. In 1984, an actor on a television show knew that his gun was loaded with blanks and empty cartridges. He put the gun to his head and pulled the trigger as a joke, and the bullet and gas exploded with so much force that it pushed a section of his skull into his brain. Since then there have been other deaths in film, and even stage plays. Although blanks are primarily used to make a bang and a flash, they're not just noisemakers. Any closer than a couple of feet, and they can be deadly.
So when u sell a blank.......dont think law is sleeping....u are being watched (specially all those mobile dealers who sell on line without paying or collecting taxes)

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Re: Gun Loaded With Blanks Can Still Kill You !

Post by Hammerhead » Tue May 12, 2015 4:33 am

YES !




Under Canadian Crimnal Code, you point a gun at someone - Five Years

And if you point a gun at someone, person got heart attack - Life

So if you point a gun at someone and shoot blank, even if person does not die - You're Dead !
The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing. - Edmund Burke

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Re: Gun Loaded With Blanks Can Still Kill You !

Post by essdee1972 » Tue May 12, 2015 10:54 am

And if you point a gun at someone, person got heart attack - Life
Interesting! What if I do a Halloween trick on the guy and he dies of a heart attack??

Seriously, sudden changes in air pressure can kill, if intense enough. Even without the wad of paper, the pressure of such a lot of gases, suddenly released, banging against the skull could cause enough concussive force to kill. More so, as the "drama" with a blank gun is usually done holding (pressing) the gun to the temple, one of the weakest points in the skull. And the forces which cause the bullet to move at such high velocities will of course exert a high pressure on the temple.

Cause of death: Severe concussive force to the brain.
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Re: Gun Loaded With Blanks Can Still Kill You !

Post by goodboy_mentor » Tue May 12, 2015 12:51 pm

It is something similar to holding oxy- acetylene welding torch flame against or near the skull.
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Re: Gun Loaded With Blanks Can Still Kill You !

Post by ckkalyan » Tue May 12, 2015 12:55 pm

:agree:

Although a wad could cause substantial damage even at longer ranges.

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Basic anatomy of a cartridge
from here https://www.google.ca/search?q=parts+of ... B299%3B346
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Re: Gun Loaded With Blanks Can Still Kill You !

Post by kshitij » Tue May 12, 2015 4:39 pm

I can think of 100s of daily use tools that could probably kill. Heck, people have managed to kill themselves using a hairdryer or even puking into their commodes :lol:

Why demonize inanimate objects or their mere possession when the accountability of any mishap rests solely with the person using/misusing the said tool/equipment. I thought we were on the pro gun side of the argument, then why have such sensational topic heads? Not that I plan to own a loud toy "gun" but do i need to be worried that the "law is watching me" if i ever feel like procuring one?

We recently had a guy get arrested some where down south for trying to procure a blank gun. If i recollect right, we all agreed that the action was undue. When we start a post like this aren't we countering ourselves??

Besides, I thought the blank guns have completely sealed barrels so as to prevent the gun from being modified into something that can fire a projectile. ( I may be wrong on this. )
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Re: Gun Loaded With Blanks Can Still Kill You !

Post by aadhaulya » Tue May 12, 2015 8:45 pm

kshitij wrote:Not that I plan to own a loud toy "gun" but do i need to be worried that the "law is watching me" if i ever feel like procuring one?
:agree: :agree:
art_collector wrote:.
So when u sell a blank.......dont think law is sleeping....u are being watched (specially all those mobile dealers who sell on line without paying or collecting taxes)
art_collector,

I actually did not understand the above part :stupid:

When you buy real ammo nobody is watching you, although there is a system in place that makes sure that big bro can watch you any time. But as for as the blank guns and ammo are concerned no system exists to watch you. Even if 'you' decide to take a bill for your purchase you need to give a name only with no proof of identity, so who and how can somebody watch you??

Regards

Atul

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Re: Gun Loaded With Blanks Can Still Kill You !

Post by TwoRivers » Tue May 12, 2015 11:18 pm

First off, a "blank" cartridge does not have a bullet. So, before posting one should probably learn the difference between "bullet" and "cartridge".
Second, there is a difference between blank cartridges for firing in a regular gun, which are loaded with a special extremely fast burning powder; and blank cartridges for a gun firing blanks only, and only carry priming compound.

Third, then there a "movie blanks", with which the mentioned accident occurred, loaded with a heavy charge of black powder for realism in a movie. The newer all-plastic military blanks are another story yet. The have pretty much replaced the formerly used hollow wooden bullets, or extra long crimped brass blanks still in use by the US forces.

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Re: Gun Loaded With Blanks Can Still Kill You !

Post by goodboy_mentor » Wed May 13, 2015 10:38 am

aadhaulya wrote:
kshitij wrote:Not that I plan to own a loud toy "gun" but do i need to be worried that the "law is watching me" if i ever feel like procuring one?
:agree: :agree:
art_collector wrote:.
So when u sell a blank.......dont think law is sleeping....u are being watched (specially all those mobile dealers who sell on line without paying or collecting taxes)
art_collector,

I actually did not understand the above part :stupid:

When you buy real ammo nobody is watching you, although there is a system in place that makes sure that big bro can watch you any time. But as for as the blank guns and ammo are concerned no system exists to watch you. Even if 'you' decide to take a bill for your purchase you need to give a name only with no proof of identity, so who and how can somebody watch you??

Regards

Atul
First of all, a blank gun to be a gun(firearm) under Arms Act 1959, it has to be capable of firing a projectile.

For the purpose of following thread http://indiansforguns.com/viewtopic.php ... 77#p229877 was reading Arms Act and its Rules and trying to decode it. As per my understanding, the heart and soul for all requirements of licensing in Arms Act 1959(or any licensing under any legislation), is the legislative powers in Articles 302, 304, 305, 307 to regulate "trade, commerce and intercourse" in PART XIII of the Constitution. Anything that is not "trade, commerce and intercourse", Parliament does not have power of licensing under Arms Act 1959 or any Act for that matter. This is the crux of the matter or foundation of licensing under Arms Act 1959. It is about regulating and taxing "trade, commerce and intercourse". Arms Act is not about preventing or tracking potential criminals or solving crime.

That is why there is Section 42 in Arms Act for conducting a census of firearms. The census has to be conducted within four walls of Census Act 1948. Census Act ensures that no information collected can be used for any civil or criminal suit. It is unfortunate that due to rampart legal ignorance of citizens, with disregard to Constitution the government is proposing all manner of tracking features in Arms Rules.

Section 41 in Arms Act also exists for similar "trade, commerce and intercourse" reasons or lack of reasons to be done for public interest as mentioned in Article 302.

Similarly Section 45 of Arms Act 1959 is to exclude anything and everything that is not part of "trade, commerce and intercourse" and thus cannot be put under licensing. For example, since any weapon of obsolete pattern or of antiquarian value or in disrepair which is not capable of being used as a Firearm either or without repair means all these are not part of "trade, commerce and intercourse" and are part of freedom and liberty under Part III. Parliament does not have competence to bring them under regulations. That is why Section 45(c) of Arms Act cannot cover them. It has been discussed in following thread http://indiansforguns.com/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=15556

Will be posting more details in the thread for draft regulations very soon.
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Re: Gun Loaded With Blanks Can Still Kill You !

Post by aadhaulya » Wed May 13, 2015 7:23 pm

GBM,

How did I miss out on such an important post, where as I tried to put in my views before getting an input from you. Hope to get more clarifications on th Arms Act and Rules.

Regards

Atul

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Re: Gun Loaded With Blanks Can Still Kill You !

Post by Vakil Saab » Tue May 24, 2016 11:38 pm

kshitij wrote:
Besides, I thought the blank guns have completely sealed barrels so as to prevent the gun from being modified into something that can fire a projectile. ( I may be wrong on this. )
There are two types of blank guns: the front firing type in which the barrel is not sealed and the other one in which the front opening of the barrel is sealed but there is an upward hole in the middle of it.
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Re: Gun Loaded With Blanks Can Still Kill You !

Post by mundaire » Wed May 25, 2016 7:42 am

AFAIK no one makes blank guns with a functioning barrel. They all have plugged barrels and vent the gases either upwards/ downwards/ sideways.

If you know of any make/ model which comes with a functioning barrel, please feel free to contradict me.

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Re: Gun Loaded With Blanks Can Still Kill You !

Post by Vakil Saab » Wed May 25, 2016 9:49 am

mundaire wrote:AFAIK no one makes blank guns with a functioning barrel. They all have plugged barrels and vent the gases either upwards/ downwards/ sideways.

If you know of any make/ model which comes with a functioning barrel, please feel free to contradict me.
Most of the modern BGs do not vent the flash/gases up/down/sideways. It is common nowadays for them to have the front opening. They are not absolutely unrestricted though, as there is some or the other thing inside the barrel to ensure a "PHAT KE PHLAWARED" condition, if someone tries to put a real bullet in it.

Interestingly, a good number of these new BGs also come with a flare adapter with which they can even shoot a flare out of its front barrel.

Cf. 1. Modern Blank Guns>>
& 2. Dangers of shooting a blank gun at a person>>
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